Is kale high in oxalate?

In this episode, Jeff Sarris and Jill Harris discuss the impact of oxalates in foods, particularly focusing on kale and spinach. They explore the nutritional value of kale, its low oxalate content, and how it can be a beneficial addition to a kidney stone prevention diet. The conversation emphasizes the importance of dietary variety and encourages listeners to embrace new foods while avoiding high-oxalate options. Jill shares insights on meal planning and the benefits of a diverse diet for overall health and kidney stone prevention.

Takeaways

Kale is low in oxalates, making it a safe choice.
Spinach has high oxalate content and should be avoided.
Understanding oxalate levels helps in meal planning.
Variety in diet is crucial for kidney stone prevention.
Meal plans can simplify dietary changes.
Kale can be prepared in enjoyable ways.
Exploring different vegetables can enhance nutrition.
A diverse diet supports gut health.
Avoiding high-oxalate foods can prevent kidney stones.
Embracing new foods can lead to a healthier lifestyle.

00:00 Understanding Oxalates in Foods
01:59 Kale vs. Spinach: The Oxalate Debate
04:51 Exploring Alternatives to Spinach
07:59 The Importance of Variety in Diet
11:06 Embracing the Kidney Stone Diet

Jeff Sarris (00:00):
Is kale high in oxalate? Let’s talk about that.

It’s a big question because you think, okay, spinach, that’s not great. There are other veggies and fruits. Those aren’t great. What about kale? Kale seems like another super food, another one of those sort of, “I’m going to have more of this to have more health.” So is that actually a problem? It’s really important to dive into.

Kale Is Low – Bring It Back!

Jill (00:20):
Yes. Yes. It really is. And kale is also one of those foods that’s super annoying because “Jill, one list says this, that list says this, this one said this.” Kale is low, folks. Bring it on back. Now, Harvard even re-studied kale. It was low on their first Harvard Oxalate food list. And when they re-did kale, it was also low. OK? So low. How low is low, Jill? Kale, one cup, less than one milligram of oxalate, 0.7 milligrams of oxalate. So yes, you can have kale. “Kale sucks, Jill, I want my spinach back.” No, no, no, sorry Trudy, spinach is off your plate. It’s over 600 milligrams of oxalate for I think a cup of spinach. And by the time you boil spinach down, you got about an eyeful, a thimble. So off your plate, okay?

Jeff Sarris (01:20):
And why does that number matter too for someone who might not really, they clipped on this because of oxalate, but how much can you have in a day to really be safe, say?

The Oxalate Budget System

Jill (01:29):
Well, I always use the bank account analogy because it seems to resonate with people. So when I’m talking to people privately in my private consult, I say this, “All right, Bobby, we’re putting 100 milligrams in your Oxalate bank account. I just opened it and I just sent you a debit card because you’re a grown ass man and you can decide how much oxalate. You know, if you want to have half a baked potato and that’s 40 something milligrams of oxalate, you still got 50 something milligrams of oxalate left, right? So you get to decide what food you want.”

I’m only taking away, this is what I absolutely take away, spinach, almond products, cashews. That means anything made with cashews off the table. Almonds off the table, almond bread, almond milk, all the things you were drinking on keto and low carb. Nope. So spinach, cashew products, almond products.

Now, Harvard did not study chia seeds, but every other list in the world says they’re high. And most people aren’t having chia seeds once a month, they’re having it every day. Chia pudding, chia pudding, chia pudding. Okay? So I take those things away. Now, there’s things I do not take away, and they are definitely on the higher oxalate food list. And we have the highest oxalate foods at kidneystonediet.com, a list and baked potatoes are on that list there are 97 milligrams for a whole baked potato but I say have half and it’s 50 milligrams of oxalate, you still have 50 left because sometimes a gal or a guy needs a friggin baked potato. “Well Jill I would just take the skin off” and I’m like “Well Frank that’s the whole reason I have the damn baked potato with the skin Jill but it’s true.” So if you want a half a baked potato pair it with some calcium and eat your baked potato. It’s what we do every single day, all the time. But spinach, you can clearly see, off the table. That breaks your budget with just the one food. Cashews breaks the budget. Almond products breaks the budget. Chia seeds pretty much breaks the, you know, if you, people like, “I need them Jill, I need them.” “I need them for health.” Well, have them once a week, but don’t think you’re gaining a whole bunch of health from one chia pudding, Fran. That’s not happening, okay? Anyway.

How to Use Kale Successfully

So those are foods I definitely take away. Kale is very, very one of the lowest foods you can eat. And people will say, like I started the conversation, “I don’t like it. It’s fibrous. I don’t know what to do with it. It’s too crunchy. It’s not smooth like spinach. It’s not sweet like spinach.” I’m going to tell you what, if you know how to use kale, it’s just as fun as spinach.

And plus spinach leaves that waxy feel all over your mouth. Me personally, I’ve never been a fan. But I don’t eat any of those products because my family members have stones, I don’t want them, and so I too follow the same Kidney Stone Diet you guys do. So, kale. I love a kale salad. I’ll put a whole bunch of things in my kale salad. And I take the kale. I, there’s always a stem in the middle of kale. So I de-stem it and then I kind of crinkle it up in my hands. I cut it up in smaller pieces and you may be like, “I don’t want to do all that.” Well, for you, there is baby kale and you can get that in a bag or a plastic box in the salad section. And it’s wonderful. It’s not very fibrous at all, this tiny little leaves. And I promise you, you’ll like it just as much as spinach. Maybe not as much because there’s some real spinach Popeye eaters out there, but you will be like, “All right, she’s right. It’s not so bad. I’ll eat spinach instead.” But guess what? So please enjoy spinach, but get rid of spinach. Please enjoy kale. Sorry. Please enjoy kale. Get rid of spinach and any other lettuce you can have.

Try Different Greens and Variety

I like arugula in my meal plan service. I use a lot of salads with arugula. I do use kale. I’ll use romaine. I’ll use shredded lettuce. So you can use any other iceberg lettuce if you want a real crunchy, cool salad. You can use mixed greens as spring mix as long as they’re not spinach in those mixed salads. Please. There’s a lot more going on in the world besides spinach people. So try a variety of different lettuces. You’re going to be very surprised. Arugula is a wonderful lettuce. It has a little peppery flavoring in your salad and you’re going to love it. So open up your horizons.

Also, here’s another thing. Most people I talk to every single day, eating this. They ate the same foods every single day and that’s what led to their stone along with not getting any calcium. Once so many, you know, one of our most popular services, Jeff, as you know, is the meal plan because it solves the problem. “What the hell am I supposed to eat? I can’t eat this. I can’t eat this. I have fatty liver. I can’t eat this. I can’t eat this. I’m diabetic.” The meal plan has everything from keto to veggie to vegan to paleo to regular old folk. It has salads. It has soups. It has everything. Hundreds of recipes. You get in your inbox every single week and it gives you ideas and inspirations the whole week. Breakfast, lunch, dinner and a snack. All kidney stone diet compliant. Try that and you’re going to see my salads are delicious.

My Philosophy: Bringing Foods Back

I just made for the meal plan. I haven’t written it up yet, but a beautiful summertime mango salad made with the arugula. And I’m like “Well I don’t need pepper in this recipe because the arugula is already peppery.” Mangoes, red onions, a little goat cheese. You don’t like goat cheese, you’re vegan, take it out. I mean delicious with the lime vinaigrette and I put I made my own little turkey breast and I put that on top. You could lose the meat, put chicken, put whatever you want, put, you know what else would be good on that? I know you didn’t ask, salmon that would be very nice on top, but some shrimp, whatever.

Most people, once they start the kidney stone diet, and certainly when they start the meal plan service, they’re like, “I have never eaten better. I would go to the produce section, get an apple, and keep my cart going.” The produce section has everything you need for a healthy diet, except spinach. But explore the fruits and vegetables. You all take a piece of corn and an apple and off you go. There’s so many gorgeous wonderful fruits and vegetables. Try different ones. Remember each time you’re trying a new fruit or vegetable, you’re giving your gut a whole different nutrient source. And I mean there’s 30 trillion different microbes in our gut. Do you think the same apple and piece of corn is serving all of them? I mean you want a wide variety of foods.

And I can’t tell you how many people were like “Jill when I saw that meal that you said for Monday. I was like ‘What the hell kind of combination is this?’ but I said I’ll try it because all the other ones are really good. I tried it, it was delicious.” So I mean I’m trying to bring foods back to your plate that you took away. And also increase your nutrient base to your gut, to your mind, to your body so you get a wide variety of fruits and vegetables and nutrients for your body. Not the same damn oatmeal you’ve had for 20 years, people. Even if you said, “Well, Jill, I like my oatmeal.” Even if you try different fruits in there every day, that would be more of a variety. You know what I mean?

This Is About More Than Just Kidney Stones

So part of why I have loved teaching kidney stone prevention for all these years is just been an avenue for me to teach people about nutrition and see with kidney stones, I have very captive audience because they never want to go through that pain again and they will listen to me. So they’ll say, “All right, I’ll try it because I never, Jill, want to go through that again.” So they open their eyes to a healthier diet with more nuances and different flavors and different fruits and different vegetables and different ways to do things.

And honestly, I’m not making this up. They will tell me “My whole life has changed because of this. I hated having a kidney stone, but I’m thankful and grateful because I would have never changed my diet otherwise. I would have never lost this weight because the idea of looking cute in my bikini was not as important as not having the stone is.” So when you get sick, no matter what that illness is, cancer, kidney stones, fatty liver, diabetes, whatever, you become a really captive student now. And you don’t want to be sick anymore because y’all know there’s nothing worse than that. There’s nothing worse than being sick.

So don’t come here telling me that you’re sad about spinach. Be sad for a half hour and get over yourself because there’s nothing, there’s nothing better than feeling good. There’s nothing. You won’t think about spinach if you never make a stone again. And there’s plenty of other fruits and vegetables. Don’t hang your hat on just one veggie, because there’s so many that you haven’t tried and you’re going to love. So embrace the kidney stone diet. It’s all about bringing new foods into your plate instead of just focusing on the few things you can’t have. And I’ll end it there, my little soap box.

Jeff Sarris (11:30):
Yeah. Yeah. If you have a goal of preventing kidney stones, have the system. Kidney Stone Diet is the system to actually achieve the ends that you want. And you can find all of the details on this channel, in this podcast, but also at kidneystonediet.com there’s free care, premium care, if you want to work directly with Jill, or if you want to have the all access pass where you have the kidney stone prevention course, meal plans, as Jill mentioned, group calls with Jill, just everything, eBooks.

Jill (11:37):
Yes.

Jeff Sarris (11:58):
Everything that you could need. Yeah. Everything you could possibly need. Yeah. Yeah. With that, we’ll wrap for this week and we’ll see you next week.

Jill (11:58):
That whole membership. Yes. Become a member. Bye guys.