# Fact or Fiction: Calcium caused your kidney stones Source: https://kidneystonediet.com/preview/ep/fact-or-fiction-calcium-caused-your-kidney-stones/ Published: 2024-02-27 --- [![Kidney Stone Diet Podcast](https://kidneystonediet.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/Kidney-Stone-Diet-Podcast-1-1024x1024.jpg)](https://kidneystonediet.com/preview/podcast/) [YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHSAhfNgbLc)[Apple Podcasts](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fact-or-fiction-calcium-caused-your-kidney-stones/id1528474326?i=1000647242413&uo=4)[Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/episode/5EJyPqf56JQBAzm1kZpH7C)[Amazon Music](https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/0868148d-adfd-411d-b3f2-71a0ad1461ec) February 27, 2024 --- ![Jeff Sarris](https://kidneystonediet.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/02/Jeff-Sarris-150x150.jpg) Jeff Sarris Host ![Jill Harris](https://kidneystonediet.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Kidney-Stone-Diet-Jill-Harris-150x150.jpg) Jill Harris Host In this episode, Jill addresses the first kidney stone myth, which is the belief that drinking milk should be stopped to prevent calcium oxalate stones. Jill explains that not getting enough calcium can actually increase the risk of kidney stones and bone loss. She emphasizes the need for a balanced intake of calcium and provides insights into the role of calcium in preventing kidney stones. **Takeaways** - Effective partnerships require mutual respect, admiration, and the ability to recognize and utilize each person’s strengths. - Drinking milk is not a cause of calcium stones; in fact, not getting enough calcium can increase the risk of kidney stones and bone loss. - Calcium plays a crucial role in preventing kidney stones by binding with oxalate in the intestines and kidneys, preventing stone formation. - Interpretation and advocacy are essential in medical appointments to ensure proper understanding and effective communication with healthcare providers. This podcast is designed to entertain and inform — not provide medical advice. Always consult your doctor before starting any treatment. **HAVE A QUESTION? _**\ Leave us a voicemail at (773) 789-8763. \ **SUPPORT THE SHOW _** - [Join the Patreon](https://patreon.com/kidneystonediet) - Rate Kidney Stone Diet on [Apple Podcasts](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/kidney-stone-diet/id1528474326) or [Spotify](https://open.spotify.com/show/5O9BXOJUFnnT6JSgfxramx?si=T6lIOozgTUO8K6MobpVWsQ) - **BUY JILL’S FAVORITE PRODUCTS _** - [Silk Coconut Milk, Unsweetened](https://amzn.to/3jUd9x8) - [Good Karma Non Dairy Unsweetened Flaxmilk](https://amzn.to/3vQZN7J) - [Ripple Unsweetened Pea Milk](https://amzn.to/3GOP7wB) - [Oatly Unsweetened Oat Milk](https://amzn.to/3Gvjwi2) - [Healthy ‘N Fit 100% Egg Protein](https://amzn.to/3lgfXWb) - [Fairlife Core Power Elite High Protein Shake, Vanilla](https://amzn.to/3jlVKNV) - [Hydroflask](https://amzn.to/3CAD2bU) - [TofuBud Tofu Press](https://amzn.to/3vTkxie) - [Mini Cuisinart Food Processor](https://amzn.to/3vPxtpx) - [Food Scale](https://amzn.to/42cCcgX) - [Meat Thermometer](https://amzn.to/493DGfY) - [PB2 Powdered Peanut Butter](https://amzn.to/490075q) - [Gluten-Free Oat Bran Cereal](https://amzn.to/48K9FlA) - [Apple Chips](https://amzn.to/3Ht0ryb) - [Drinking Glasses with Measurements](https://amzn.to/48IKi3D) - [Balsamic Vinegar](https://amzn.to/48JFoDr) - [Ground Flax Seed](https://amzn.to/48B9xER) - [Jill’s Go-To Tanktop](https://amzn.to/42hPCsb) - [Heart-Shaped Smoothie Straws](https://amzn.to/42a1Y5v) - [Yeti Water Bottle](https://amzn.to/49o830T) - [Overnight Oatmeal Cups](https://amzn.to/47UUp4c) - [Vanilla Bean Paste](https://amzn.to/4bjHMCC) - **WORK WITH JILL _** - [Kidney Stone Prevention Course](https://kidneystonediet.com/kidney-stone-prevention) - [Kidney Stone Diet Meal Plans](https://kidneystonediet.com/mealplans/) - [Safe Snacks and Desserts Ebook](https://kidneystonediet.com/ebook/) - [24 Hour Urine Collection Analysis](https://kidneystonediet.com/24-hour-urine-analysis/) - [Private Coaching](https://kidneystonediet.com/coaching/) - **KIDNEY STONE RESOURCES _** - [Kidney Stone Diet](https://kidneystonediet.com/) - [Kidney Stone Diet Resources](https://kidneystonediet.com/resources/) - [Oxalate Food List](https://kidneystonediet.com/oxalate-list/) - [Kidney Stone Diet Recipes](https://kidneystonediet.com/recipes/) - [Meat Protein Calculator](https://kidneystonediet.com/protein/) - [Kidney Stone Diet Podcast](https://kidneystonediet.com/podcast) \ **WHO IS JILL HARRIS? _**\ Jill is a nurse and health coach that specializes in educating patients on kidney stone prevention. For more than 25 years she’s helped patients understand that kidney stones can be prevented with the right treatment plan. It’s one thing to be told to lower oxalate or drink more water, but HOW do you do it? That’s where she comes in. Through the educational resources at [kidneystonediet.com](https://kidneystonediet.com/), stone formers can learn everything they need to know to significantly lower new stone risk. *Some of the links above may be affiliate links which means that we earn a small commission from qualifying purchases at no additional cost to you. Thanks for your support!* ## Chapters - 00:00:00 Behind the Scenes of Kidney Stone Prevention Content - 00:03:25 The Myth of Restricting Calcium for Kidney Stones - 00:05:19 How Dietary Calcium Binds Oxalate in Intestines - 00:11:28 Parathyroid Dysfunction and Idiopathic Hypercalciuria - 00:14:35 Preparing Questions for 24-Hour Urine Collection Visits ## Transcript ### Behind the Scenes of Kidney Stone Prevention Content 00:00:00 Jill Harris The following is designed to entertain and inform, not provide medical advice. Always consult your doctor before starting any treatment. 00:00:20 Jeff Sarris Welcome back to the Kidney Stone Diet Podcast, the show about reducing your kidney stone risk and living your best life. I'm your host and fellow student, Jeff Sarris. 00:00:28 Jill Harris And I'm Jill Harris, your kidney stone preventionist. And I was just looking at Jeff, and I'm just loving him extra. 00:00:35 Jeff Sarris Oh. 00:00:36 Jill Harris I am, I'm just loving you extra. I'm so grateful for you in my life. 00:00:39 Jeff Sarris I'm grateful for you, too. 00:00:41 Jill Harris Yeah, I really am. You know, Jeff does so many important things behind the scenes, things that he doesn't even tell me because he knows my eyes will glaze over. But, I mean, without Jeff, there's no meal plan. Without Jeff, there's no– the website doesn't work. Without Jeff, I mean, he does all the nitty-gritty stuff behind the scenes. Without Jeff, there's no YouTube channel because I'm not– he's producing all this, he's doing all the things. So I just show up and get questions. And then Dave, who's the third person in this in our partnership, I mean, he makes everything beautiful. He– the website is all the infographics we share, all the meal plan pictures. I take the pictures, but he makes beautiful info stuff from them, so. I mean, it's– it's just a beautiful threesome, and it's just, you know, sometimes in life, you meet people and you– you join together for a very specific cause and everybody has their own thing and it just works and everybody respects each other and admires each other, leaves each other alone, only speaks to each other when they really need to. You know what I mean? It's not like we're meeting every day. We just are– are– are so good at the things that we do, each of us, that it's just– it's just amazing. You know, isn't it? It's just so– it's not effortless because we are all really working hard. I don't want anyone to think it's like that. But us working together is really effortless, and that is so rare in life, isn't it? 00:01:42 Jeff Sarris Yeah, and it's so important because like I have conversations like this a lot. Like, how do you find a partner? How do you partner with people? And I think the big thing is not having ego and being able to understand this is what I'm good at. This is what you're good at. This is what he's good at. And like we're not stepping on each other's toes. We're not trying to get credit for anything that makes no sense, just it has nothing to do with ego. It's just about creating the best thing we can create together. And when you find that, it's really rare, but when you find that, it's amazing. And I think that's what we have here. 00:02:04 Jill Harris It is– it is amazing because we all have stress in our lives doing all the work that we do. And the fact that you're working with, partners that there is no– there is only gratitude, admiration, adoration, and complete love. I mean, I don't know what to tell you. It's like, it's just– it's just amazing. So, when– when the music went on and I looked up and I saw you, I'm like, "God, I just love him so much, and I'm just so grateful." That's how I feel. I'm so grateful for Dave, and I always tell him that, too. But, you know, we're just– we're just lucky. I just feel very blessed, you know? 00:02:41 Jeff Sarris Yeah. 00:02:41 Jill Harris Without being like a picture, like a Rachel Dunn picture in Marshall's, "Blessed." I mean, I just do, though. I mean, that's how I feel. I just feel over-the-top filled with gratitude because it's a beautiful, partnership that we have. Really is. 00:03:00 Jeff Sarris Absolutely. Yeah, and if you're only listening, head over to YouTube, you get to see Jill's smiling face, especially at the beginning of this episode. It's a huge smile. Just, I don't know, it just warms your heart seeing you. But, yeah, so this week, we were going to dive into some kidney stone myths. There's a whole laundry list of myths that you have, that you face consistently. So, we're going to start, start with some today. ### The Myth of Restricting Calcium for Kidney Stones 00:03:25 Jill Harris Okay. There's no particular order. They're just common things that I'm asked all the time. I wrote them down. I got lots of them. I wrote them down. And so, we may– this will just be a series because of– there's just so many. So, let's start with if your doctor says, or if you assume, you should stop drinking milk, if you drink milk. I don't drink milk, Jill. Whatever. Let's just– let's just say, no calcium. You were told you make a calcium– just a calcium stone. Lots of doctors just say, "You make calcium stones. Stop drinking milk," or, "Don't use calcium." Whoo! That's a myth. That's a big myth. As a matter of fact, if you don't get enough calcium, you will increase your kidney stone risk. If you do not get enough calcium, you will increase your kidney stone risk. Also, my main goal is for you to lower your kidney stone risk, but I'm also looking at you as a whole human being, and Jeff knows exactly what I'm going to say. You also have a what, Jeff? 00:05:18 Jeff Sarris Skeleton. ### How Dietary Calcium Binds Oxalate in Intestines 00:05:19 Jill Harris Yes, and you need to feed it. So, for– we're all getting to the age where we may be having some bone loss, and so not getting enough calcium can definitely increase your risk for– for bone loss as well, osteopenia, osteoporosis. So, it is a myth that you will lower your stone risk by lowering calcium. That is not true. You are more at risk if you don't get calcium. So, here's what happens. Oxalate cannot leave your body unless it has calcium to join with in the intestines. Once they join together in the intestines, the excess oxalate will leave through the stool, so it cannot get reabsorbed, oxalate, back into your bloodstream and accumulate. Calcium and oxalate also join in your kidney. That's why you don't want to allow extra absorption. You want to get rid of that extra oxalate, and so you don't want those two things to join in the kidney because that's where they form kidney stones. So, it's confusing. There's videos in this– on this channel that explains that. But what I want you to know is, men and women need up to, not over, 1,000 milligrams of calcium a day. Never more than 500 milligrams at a time because we don't absorb calcium that great. Women who no longer get their period need up to 1,200 milligrams of calcium a day. This will help minimize bone loss. It will help lower oxalate in your body and it will lower your stone risk. Some of you, when I look at your– not some of you, many of you, when I look at your urine collections, you have high urine calcium and you will say to me, "Jill, I don't drink any milk. I don't even know where calcium is. Why is my urine calcium so high?" Calcium is much more of a kidney stone risk than oxalate. I'm going to tell you right now, folks, once you get rid of spinach and, almonds, calcium is the main issue why people get kidney stones, and the Kidney Stone Diet goals are all there to lower urine calcium. The annoying, "lower your sodium to 1,500 milligrams a day," "lower your added sugar to 25 grams of added sugar a day for women and 38 grams for added sugar for men," and eat normal amounts of meat protein for your size. Those goals are there to lower urine calcium because too much of those things, salt, sugar, and meat protein, which includes fish, anything that swims, fish, or runs, that's meat, so you want to eat normal amounts for your body. When we overeat those things, calcium is leached out of our bone, increasing our risk for osteopenia, which is the beginning of bone disease, and osteoporosis, full-blown bone disease, but also, it will increase your kidney stone risk because now you have all this excess calcium in your urine, you're eating a ton of spinach and almonds, you don't know nothing about nothing yet, and those that excess of calcium and oxalate, or also phosphorus, all this other stuff that can be excess in your urine, calcium can also combine with phosphate, make calcium phosphate stones. So, the calcium is the issue for many kidney stone formers, not just oxalate. Get away spinach and almonds, you don't have an oxalate problem anymore, but calcium, you still may, and this is precisely why you need a 24-hour urine collection. You would never know you have hypercalciuria, which is too much calcium in the urine, unless you did a 24-hour urine collection, and you won't know anything about calcium, no one will talk to you about it, no doctor's ever like, "You get enough calcium?" not until you have kidney stones or bone disease. That's when we're talked to about calcium. So, that's usually around 50 to 60. Meanwhile, you have never, since you were five, had any calcium. Now, I just want to, because we all know I go off on tangents, but I want to explain calcium for you guys. It is a myth to not get any calcium. You need calcium to lower your oxalate, thereby decreasing your kidney stone risk. You also need calcium for your bones. And you need to follow the Kidney Stone Diet to lower calcium leaching from your bones and being thrown into the urine, okay? So, it is a myth. You all need calcium. There's plenty of articles on my blog to get it as– if you're a vegan or vegetarian, non-dairy ways to get your calcium and regular ways like, you know, well, not regular, you know, other ways like dairy, okay? Lactose-free milk, milk, whatever. So, go to the blog at kidneystonediet.com. Also, this channel has plenty of stuff on non-dairy milks or how– calcium in general. So, myth number one, doesn't mean it's the most popular myth, but it's a big one. Please get enough calcium and that will lower your kidney stone risk. The opposite will increase your kidney stone risk. Ta-da! 00:11:08 Jeff Sarris What a ta-da. But that is what's so, I don't want to say misleading, but it's hard to grasp that, yeah, our urine calcium is too high. So, like in our mind, it's like I'm consuming too much calcium. It's like it's this weird… ### Parathyroid Dysfunction and Idiopathic Hypercalciuria 00:11:28 Jill Harris Absolutely! It's counterintuitive, right? So, people are like, "I don't even have calcium. Why's my calcium so high?" Well, you're eating 6,000 milligrams of sodium, and the sodium is pushing this extra calcium from your bone, and also, by the way, you better get go get your bones checked, too, because you could have osteoporosis, because this isn't just a one-off, this has been going on, right? The other thing with calcium is sometimes our vitamin D is way too high, sometimes our vitamin D is way too low, and so that's another thing why people have screwed-up calcium levels. The other thing is people have parathyroid issues, maybe they have a tumor on their parathyroid. If you're listening on Spotify, Audible, or Apple, you can't see me, but I– the glands around your thyroid, there's four glands around your thyroid, and it looks like a little butterfly, and the thyroid's the body of the butterfly. Sometimes those parathyroid glands can have tumors and they can secrete too much calcium because the parathyroid controls calcium. Sometimes it doesn't work so well, or it's overreacting and spilling too much calcium. So, if you do have high urine calcium, you need to get that– so, you do your urine collection, that's how you're going to know if you have it. And then there's– when I talk to patients, I'm like talk to your doctor about getting this test, this test, this test, to rule out reasons why you may have high urine calcium and also make sure you're doing the Kidney Stone Diet or fill those goals, and if all that stuff is cool, you'll then be told that you have idiopathic hypercalciuria, which is a big fancy name that simply means, "idiopathic," we've ruled everything else out, medically and diet-wise, "hyper," too much, "cal," calcium, "-uria," in the urine. So, idiopathic means there's no reason why this patient has this high urine calcium. It's idiopathic. Could be genetics. And sometimes, well, up to 50% of people who have– if you have high urine calcium just because, everything else is cool and you just have it, up to 50% of your blood relatives will also have it, too, and that's the reason why this can run in families. So, this calcium part is so important, and the biggest reason I complain about people not getting urine collections ordered, if your doctor said you don't need a urine collection, you better push back, and if he says it again, because I had a patient, you know, the other day that said, "Well, he said no. I just– he said no. I don't know what to tell you. I'm going to get another doctor, I guess." Yeah, you should! Or any doctor, nurse practitioner, or physician's assistant can order these. Anybody can. They probably don't know how to interpret them, but then you got me for that, and then I can tell you how to talk to the doctor so you can get on the right treatment plan and the right test done. So, I don't diagnose anybody, but I teach them in those urine analysis calls, here's what everything means, here's what to talk to your doctor about, right? That's how that goes. So, the calcium thing's a big deal. ### Preparing Questions for 24-Hour Urine Collection Visits Yes. 00:14:35 Jeff Sarris That's so important. And to have someone who can help interpret it in a way where you can get a better, have a better doctor visit. That is huge. 00:14:44 Jill Harris Whole point of that, yes. That's the whole– Listen, when I was going through all my chemo and stuff, I was like, man, that's why these calls came about. I'm like, damn, if I had some kind of, you know, if I had somebody advocating for me or just put little words in my ear so I knew what to ask, and I was flying to New York every month, so I was– it was very expensive. I had to stay overnight. I'm like, oh my god, I just had this 10-minute visit about my cancer, I didn't have the right questions, I didn't, you know. So, you know, people are like, "Well, you're a nurse, you should have known." I don't know shit about cancer. I know about kidney stones. We– we all specialize in what we specialize in, and plus when you're a patient, you're scared. I'm scared. I was scared. It was very scary. I thought I was dying, for Pete's sake. It was stage IV cancer. So, you know, it was– it was very hard, and a lot of times I was in those offices by myself, and so, that's how those 24-hour urine collection calls came about. I'm like, I'm never going to let a kidney stone former feel this way, and I'm going to make sure that they know what to– how to utilize that doctor's appointment so they can be really productive and when they leave it, they didn't feel like I did when I left those doctor's offices. I felt like, I don't know, it was awful. It was not good and I don't– I don't want people to have to ever deal with that, so that's why that call was made. 00:16:02 Jeff Sarris Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, and you can find that and absolutely everything at kidneystonediet.com, including some free resources about having better doctor visits and things that can help you. Absolutely free, no cost whatsoever. There's so many resources on the site, including the free weekly email, where Jill like checks in your inbox every week and keeps you on track. 00:16:26 Jill Harris Yeah, this week I'm giving a free recipe out for Valentine's Day. So, you're missing it if you're not joined on that newsletter, kidneystonediet.com start page. Go sign up for it. Absolutely get a lot of free little discounts and deals when you are.. 00:16:40 Jeff Sarris Yeah, absolutely. So, I think with that, we will wrap. This is kidney stone myth number one, and we'll be doing a whole series of these, but if you have any specific questions, the number to call is 773-789-8763 and we'd love to feature you on a future episode. But I think with that, we'll wrap. If you enjoyed this episode, hit subscribe, give it a like. It means a lot. Helps a lot with the algorithms and reaching as many people as we can, but we appreciate each and every one of you for tuning in. 00:17:11 Jill Harris Thank you. Yeah, I love you, Jeff. I love you. 00:17:15 Jeff Sarris Love you, too. 00:17:15 Jill Harris Okay. 00:17:16 Jeff Sarris Well, with that, we'll wrap, and we'll see you next week. 00:17:18 Jill Harris Bye.